<p>Justin and Jon are joined by Jason Fried to talk about:</p><ul><li>The philosophy behind their new book <a href="https://basecamp.com/shapeup">Shape Up</a>.</li><li>Does Basecamp's approach to 6-week cycles differ for smaller teams?</li><li>"Long projects destroy morale. When things don't ship, you get frustrated." – Jason Fried</li><li>Why projects ship late (it's human nature).</li><li>Why work is like a hill.</li><li>How they make product decisions at Basecamp.</li><li>How do you know what you should work on next?</li><li>Why they don't believe in backlogs.</li><li>"That feeling of 'there's nothing to do, but there's everything to do' shouldn't be happening." – Jason Fried</li><li>"You need a system at some point. When you have two people, you can hack your way to anything. But as soon as you grow, you'll need a system." – Jason Fried</li><li>"What we have is not a perfect system. And even if it was, we don't execute these things perfectly." – Jason Fried</li></ul><p><b>★ Thanks to our sponsors:</b></p><ul><li><a href="https://www.profitwell.com/?utm_source=transistor.fm&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=buildyoursaas"><strong>ProfitWell</strong></a>'s podcast <a href="https://www.profitwell.com/blog/topic/protect-the-hustle">Protect the Hustle</a> has a new season! </li><li><strong>New sponsor: </strong><a href="https://activecampaign.com/buildyoursaas"><strong>ActiveCampaign</strong></a><strong>! </strong>Get the world's most advanced marketing & sales automation platform. Use the code <a href="https://activecampaign.com/buildyoursaas">activecampaign.com/buildyoursaas</a> and get two months free + 2 free One-on-Ones!</li></ul><p><b>Show notes:</b></p><ul><li><a href="https://twitter.com/jonbuda/status/1025429575281594369">Jon's launch announcement tweet</a> (from 2018).</li><li>Read Basecamp's new book <a href="https://basecamp.com/shapeup">Shape Up</a>.</li><li>Jason Fried commented on <a href="https://www.linkedin.com/posts/justinijackson_business-bootstrapping-startup-activity-6557467478967021568-RHV5">this Linkedin post</a>.</li><li><a href="https://basecamp.com/shapeup/3.4-chapter-12#work-is-like-a-hill">Hill charts</a>.</li><li>Listen to Rework Podcast's "<a href="https://rework.fm/shape-up-roundtable/">Shape Up Roundtable</a>."</li><li>Derek Sivers' new article: <a href="https://sivers.org/clothes">My old clothes don't fit</a></li></ul><p><b>You can reply to this podcast here:</b></p><ul><li><a href="https://www.breaker.audio/build-your-saas">Leave a comment on Breaker</a>, the podcast app for iPhone.</li><li>Otherwise, get us on Twitter: <a href="https://twitter.com/transistorfm">@transistorfm</a> or email us:
[email protected]</li></ul><p><b>Thanks to our monthly supporters:</b></p><ul><li>Ben from narrowr.com</li><li>Noah Prail</li><li>David Colgan</li><li>Robert Simplicio</li><li>Colin Gray alitu.com</li><li>Josh Smith</li><li>Ivan Curkovic</li><li><a href="https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/writing-better-onboarding-emails-with-val-geisler/id1462353330?i=1000440662987">Brian Rhea</a> (Pronounced “Ray”)</li><li>Miguel Piedrafita</li><li><a href="https://dev.transistor.fm/">Shane Smith</a></li><li>Austin Loveless</li><li><a href="https://saasreality.com/">Simon Bennett </a></li><li><a href="https://www.thediaryofanindiehacker.com/">Corey Haines</a></li><li>Michael Sitver</li><li>Paul Jarvis and Jack Ellis</li><li>Dan Buda danbuda.com</li><li>Darby Frey</li><li>Samori Augusto</li><li>Dave Young</li><li>Brad from Canada</li><li><a href="https://side-by-side.transistor.fm/">Sammy Schuckert</a></li><li><a href="https://www.brandshouter.com/">Dan Ericson</a></li><li>Mike Walker</li><li>Adam DuVander</li><li>Dave Giunta (JOOnta)</li><li>Kyle Fox GetRewardful.com</li><li>ProfitWell</li><li><a href="https://activecampaign.com/buildyoursaas"><strong>ActiveCampaign</strong></a></li><li><a href="https://www.profitwell.com/?utm_source=transistor.fm&utm_medium=podcast&utm_campaign=buildyoursaas"><strong>ProfitWell.com</strong></a></li><li><a href="https://www.getrewardful.com/?via=buildyoursaas"><strong>GetRewardful.com</strong></a></li></ul>
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